• Real life Law & Order

    From Adam H. Kerman@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 05:00:54 2025
    Real life prosecutor goes to court with less evidence than Price
    typically presents on an episode of Law & Order

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQINClZopt0

    Truly shitty arrest. Noncom officer from Ft. Knox is driving a vehicle
    that completely breaks down. He's on the side of the road for a very
    long time. Hours after a celebration of his promotion, cop arrests him
    for drunk driving because he was given a gift of a bottle of alchohol,
    and drank some after the break down, then fell asleep.

    Why did the prosecution prefer charges? In her opening remarks, she
    emphasizes that none of her witnesses are witnesses to drunken behavior
    but the jury is free to infer from the absense of evidence that he must
    have been driving drunk before his vehicle broke down.

    How did this survive the probable cause hearing?

    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From BTR1701@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 05:15:56 2025
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 12:00:54 PM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com>
    wrote:

    Real life prosecutor goes to court with less evidence than Price
    typically presents on an episode of Law & Order

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQINClZopt0

    Truly shitty arrest. Noncom officer from Ft. Knox is driving a vehicle
    that completely breaks down. He's on the side of the road for a very
    long time. Hours after a celebration of his promotion, cop arrests him
    for drunk driving because he was given a gift of a bottle of alchohol,
    and drank some after the break down, then fell asleep.

    Why did the prosecution prefer charges? In her opening remarks, she emphasizes that none of her witnesses are witnesses to drunken behavior
    but the jury is free to infer from the absense of evidence that he must
    have been driving drunk before his vehicle broke down.

    How did this survive the probable cause hearing?

    PROSECUTOR: "Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, don't be fooled by our lack of evidence here. You see, no evidence is actually evidence of guilt. I know that's not what they taught you about our justice system as far back as elementary school, but trust me, the fact that we have absolutely no proof
    that the defendant drove drunk is all the evidence we need that he drove
    drunk.

    The People rest."

    DEFENSE: "Your honor, given the fact that the prosecution has clearly lost her damn mind, the defense moves for a directed verdict."



    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From Rhino@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 05:53:29 2025
    On 2025-08-17 3:00 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
    Real life prosecutor goes to court with less evidence than Price
    typically presents on an episode of Law & Order

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQINClZopt0

    Truly shitty arrest. Noncom officer from Ft. Knox is driving a vehicle
    that completely breaks down. He's on the side of the road for a very
    long time. Hours after a celebration of his promotion, cop arrests him
    for drunk driving because he was given a gift of a bottle of alchohol,
    and drank some after the break down, then fell asleep.

    Why did the prosecution prefer charges? In her opening remarks, she emphasizes that none of her witnesses are witnesses to drunken behavior
    but the jury is free to infer from the absense of evidence that he must
    have been driving drunk before his vehicle broke down.

    How did this survive the probable cause hearing?

    I heard about a similar case here in Ontario some years ago. A guy who realized he was probably borderline impaired pulled over to the side of
    the road and decided to sleep for a while. The police came along after
    he'd been sleeping awhile and charged him with drunk driving. He pointed
    out that the car was parked, the engine was off and the keys were in his pocket but the police said he could have started the car and driven off
    at any time. I don't recall what the breathalyzer showed and I have no
    idea if he fought the charge in court or just pled guilty.

    Until then, I always thought you had to have actually been DRIVING drunk
    to catch a drunk driving charge. I never would have imagined that
    sleeping on the side of the road with alcohol in your system was enough
    to sustain a drunk driving charge. Then again, maybe they reasoned that
    if he was sleeping drunk at the side of the road, he must have driven
    drunk to get to the spot where he was sleeping.


    --
    Rhino

    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From BTR1701@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 06:23:29 2025
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 12:53:29 PM PDT, "Rhino" <no_offline_contact@example.com> wrote:

    On 2025-08-17 3:00 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
    Real life prosecutor goes to court with less evidence than Price
    typically presents on an episode of Law & Order

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQINClZopt0

    Truly shitty arrest. Noncom officer from Ft. Knox is driving a vehicle
    that completely breaks down. He's on the side of the road for a very
    long time. Hours after a celebration of his promotion, cop arrests him
    for drunk driving because he was given a gift of a bottle of alchohol,
    and drank some after the break down, then fell asleep.

    Why did the prosecution prefer charges? In her opening remarks, she
    emphasizes that none of her witnesses are witnesses to drunken behavior
    but the jury is free to infer from the absense of evidence that he must
    have been driving drunk before his vehicle broke down.

    How did this survive the probable cause hearing?

    I heard about a similar case here in Ontario some years ago. A guy who realized he was probably borderline impaired pulled over to the side of
    the road and decided to sleep for a while. The police came along after
    he'd been sleeping awhile and charged him with drunk driving. He pointed
    out that the car was parked, the engine was off and the keys were in his pocket but the police said he could have started the car and driven off
    at any time.

    I've never understood this line of logic. If merely having access to car keys is enough to charge someone with drunk driving, then they could theoretically charge you with drunk driving if you're in your home sitting on the sofa watching the ballgame and drinking beers. After all, the car keys are right there on the kitchen counter and you could take them to the garage, start the car, and drive drunk if you want to.

    Until then, I always thought you had to have actually been DRIVING drunk
    to catch a drunk driving charge. I never would have imagined that
    sleeping on the side of the road with alcohol in your system was enough
    to sustain a drunk driving charge.

    There have been people in California that have been charged with DUI because they were intoxicated within a certain distance from their car. If you're standing within 50 feet of your vehicle intoxicated and you're in possession
    of the keys, they presume you to have access to the vehicle in an intoxicated condition. Again, it would seem the cops could just walk into any bar and
    start giving all the patrons who have keys in their pockets breathalyzers and then charge them with DUI since they all "have access to their vehicle in an intoxicated condition".

    Among other drunk-driving laws that seem to have unintended consequences is
    the law that basically says, "If it has wheels, it's illegal to be drunk while operating it". This is how people riding bicycles, riding lawnmowers, even children's toys, like Big Wheels, have been charged with DUI. However, it
    would also seem to make it illegal for people in wheelchairs to ever be intoxicated.

    Sometimes it doesn't even have to be wheels. I heard of one case of a guy
    being charged with DUI for riding a horse while drunk. I seem to remember him beating the charge because the horse has a mind of its own and will avoid collisions on its own regardless of the idiotic naked ape on its back.

    Then again, maybe they reasoned that
    if he was sleeping drunk at the side of the road, he must have driven
    drunk to get to the spot where he was sleeping.

    They could reason that but they couldn't prove that.

    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was
    before she crashed or after she crashed.



    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From shawn@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 06:30:37 2025
    On Sun, 17 Aug 2025 20:23:29 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>
    wrote:

    On Aug 17, 2025 at 12:53:29 PM PDT, "Rhino" <no_offline_contact@example.com> >wrote:

    On 2025-08-17 3:00 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
    Real life prosecutor goes to court with less evidence than Price
    typically presents on an episode of Law & Order

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQINClZopt0

    Truly shitty arrest. Noncom officer from Ft. Knox is driving a vehicle
    that completely breaks down. He's on the side of the road for a very
    long time. Hours after a celebration of his promotion, cop arrests him
    for drunk driving because he was given a gift of a bottle of alchohol,
    and drank some after the break down, then fell asleep.

    Why did the prosecution prefer charges? In her opening remarks, she
    emphasizes that none of her witnesses are witnesses to drunken behavior >>> but the jury is free to infer from the absense of evidence that he must >>> have been driving drunk before his vehicle broke down.

    How did this survive the probable cause hearing?

    I heard about a similar case here in Ontario some years ago. A guy who
    realized he was probably borderline impaired pulled over to the side of
    the road and decided to sleep for a while. The police came along after
    he'd been sleeping awhile and charged him with drunk driving. He pointed
    out that the car was parked, the engine was off and the keys were in his
    pocket but the police said he could have started the car and driven off
    at any time.

    I've never understood this line of logic. If merely having access to car keys >is enough to charge someone with drunk driving, then they could theoretically >charge you with drunk driving if you're in your home sitting on the sofa >watching the ballgame and drinking beers. After all, the car keys are right >there on the kitchen counter and you could take them to the garage, start the >car, and drive drunk if you want to.

    Until then, I always thought you had to have actually been DRIVING drunk
    to catch a drunk driving charge. I never would have imagined that
    sleeping on the side of the road with alcohol in your system was enough
    to sustain a drunk driving charge.

    There have been people in California that have been charged with DUI because >they were intoxicated within a certain distance from their car. If you're >standing within 50 feet of your vehicle intoxicated and you're in possession >of the keys, they presume you to have access to the vehicle in an intoxicated >condition. Again, it would seem the cops could just walk into any bar and >start giving all the patrons who have keys in their pockets breathalyzers and >then charge them with DUI since they all "have access to their vehicle in an >intoxicated condition".

    So how does California handle people who drink but are out 'camping'
    in an RV. If they were driving then I get them being charged with DUI,
    but what about when they are at a camp site. Maybe cooking up some
    food while drinking some beers around a camp fire? Technically it
    sounds like they can be charged with a DUI since the keys and vehicle
    are there and they may even be in the vehicle, but it's hard to that
    sticking if they fought the charge.
    Among other drunk-driving laws that seem to have unintended consequences is >the law that basically says, "If it has wheels, it's illegal to be drunk while >operating it". This is how people riding bicycles, riding lawnmowers, even >children's toys, like Big Wheels, have been charged with DUI. However, it >would also seem to make it illegal for people in wheelchairs to ever be >intoxicated.

    Sometimes it doesn't even have to be wheels. I heard of one case of a guy >being charged with DUI for riding a horse while drunk. I seem to remember him >beating the charge because the horse has a mind of its own and will avoid >collisions on its own regardless of the idiotic naked ape on its back.

    Then again, maybe they reasoned that
    if he was sleeping drunk at the side of the road, he must have driven
    drunk to get to the spot where he was sleeping.

    They could reason that but they couldn't prove that.

    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started >drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew >over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was >before she crashed or after she crashed.


    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From BTR1701@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 06:34:17 2025
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 1:30:37 PM PDT, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:

    On Sun, 17 Aug 2025 20:23:29 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>
    wrote:

    On Aug 17, 2025 at 12:53:29 PM PDT, "Rhino" <no_offline_contact@example.com> >> wrote:

    On 2025-08-17 3:00 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
    Real life prosecutor goes to court with less evidence than Price
    typically presents on an episode of Law & Order

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQINClZopt0

    Truly shitty arrest. Noncom officer from Ft. Knox is driving a vehicle >>>> that completely breaks down. He's on the side of the road for a very >>>> long time. Hours after a celebration of his promotion, cop arrests him >>>> for drunk driving because he was given a gift of a bottle of alchohol, >>>> and drank some after the break down, then fell asleep.

    Why did the prosecution prefer charges? In her opening remarks, she
    emphasizes that none of her witnesses are witnesses to drunken behavior >>>> but the jury is free to infer from the absense of evidence that he must >>>> have been driving drunk before his vehicle broke down.

    How did this survive the probable cause hearing?

    I heard about a similar case here in Ontario some years ago. A guy who >>> realized he was probably borderline impaired pulled over to the side of >>> the road and decided to sleep for a while. The police came along after >>> he'd been sleeping awhile and charged him with drunk driving. He pointed >>> out that the car was parked, the engine was off and the keys were in his >>> pocket but the police said he could have started the car and driven off >>> at any time.

    I've never understood this line of logic. If merely having access to car keys
    is enough to charge someone with drunk driving, then they could theoretically
    charge you with drunk driving if you're in your home sitting on the sofa
    watching the ballgame and drinking beers. After all, the car keys are right >> there on the kitchen counter and you could take them to the garage, start the
    car, and drive drunk if you want to.

    Until then, I always thought you had to have actually been DRIVING drunk >>> to catch a drunk driving charge. I never would have imagined that
    sleeping on the side of the road with alcohol in your system was enough >>> to sustain a drunk driving charge.

    There have been people in California that have been charged with DUI because >> they were intoxicated within a certain distance from their car. If you're
    standing within 50 feet of your vehicle intoxicated and you're in possession >> of the keys, they presume you to have access to the vehicle in an intoxicated
    condition. Again, it would seem the cops could just walk into any bar and
    start giving all the patrons who have keys in their pockets breathalyzers and
    then charge them with DUI since they all "have access to their vehicle in an >> intoxicated condition".

    So how does California handle people who drink but are out 'camping'
    in an RV. If they were driving then I get them being charged with DUI,
    but what about when they are at a camp site. Maybe cooking up some
    food while drinking some beers around a camp fire? Technically it
    sounds like they can be charged with a DUI since the keys and vehicle
    are there and they may even be in the vehicle, but it's hard to that
    sticking if they fought the charge.

    It's all selective enforcement. Yes, the law would make the campers criminals, too, but the cops never charge people in situations like that, so the question has never come before a court.

    Among other drunk-driving laws that seem to have unintended consequences is >> the law that basically says, "If it has wheels, it's illegal to be drunk
    while
    operating it". This is how people riding bicycles, riding lawnmowers, even >> children's toys, like Big Wheels, have been charged with DUI. However, it
    would also seem to make it illegal for people in wheelchairs to ever be
    intoxicated.

    Sometimes it doesn't even have to be wheels. I heard of one case of a guy
    being charged with DUI for riding a horse while drunk. I seem to remember him
    beating the charge because the horse has a mind of its own and will avoid
    collisions on its own regardless of the idiotic naked ape on its back.

    Then again, maybe they reasoned that
    if he was sleeping drunk at the side of the road, he must have driven
    drunk to get to the spot where he was sleeping.

    They could reason that but they couldn't prove that.

    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started >> drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew >> over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was
    before she crashed or after she crashed.





    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From anim8rfsk@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 07:06:11 2025
    BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 1:30:37 PM PDT, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:

    On Sun, 17 Aug 2025 20:23:29 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>
    wrote:

    On Aug 17, 2025 at 12:53:29 PM PDT, "Rhino" <no_offline_contact@example.com>
    wrote:

    On 2025-08-17 3:00 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
    Real life prosecutor goes to court with less evidence than Price
    typically presents on an episode of Law & Order

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQINClZopt0

    Truly shitty arrest. Noncom officer from Ft. Knox is driving a vehicle >>>>> that completely breaks down. He's on the side of the road for a very >>>>> long time. Hours after a celebration of his promotion, cop arrests him >>>>> for drunk driving because he was given a gift of a bottle of alchohol, >>>>> and drank some after the break down, then fell asleep.

    Why did the prosecution prefer charges? In her opening remarks, she
    emphasizes that none of her witnesses are witnesses to drunken behavior >>>>> but the jury is free to infer from the absense of evidence that he must >>>>> have been driving drunk before his vehicle broke down.

    How did this survive the probable cause hearing?

    I heard about a similar case here in Ontario some years ago. A guy who >>>> realized he was probably borderline impaired pulled over to the side of >>>> the road and decided to sleep for a while. The police came along after >>>> he'd been sleeping awhile and charged him with drunk driving. He pointed >>>> out that the car was parked, the engine was off and the keys were in his >>>> pocket but the police said he could have started the car and driven off >>>> at any time.

    I've never understood this line of logic. If merely having access to car keys
    is enough to charge someone with drunk driving, then they could theoretically
    charge you with drunk driving if you're in your home sitting on the sofa >>> watching the ballgame and drinking beers. After all, the car keys are right >>> there on the kitchen counter and you could take them to the garage, start the
    car, and drive drunk if you want to.

    Until then, I always thought you had to have actually been DRIVING drunk >>>> to catch a drunk driving charge. I never would have imagined that
    sleeping on the side of the road with alcohol in your system was enough >>>> to sustain a drunk driving charge.

    There have been people in California that have been charged with DUI because
    they were intoxicated within a certain distance from their car. If you're >>> standing within 50 feet of your vehicle intoxicated and you're in possession
    of the keys, they presume you to have access to the vehicle in an intoxicated
    condition. Again, it would seem the cops could just walk into any bar and >>> start giving all the patrons who have keys in their pockets breathalyzers and
    then charge them with DUI since they all "have access to their vehicle in an
    intoxicated condition".

    So how does California handle people who drink but are out 'camping'
    in an RV. If they were driving then I get them being charged with DUI,
    but what about when they are at a camp site. Maybe cooking up some
    food while drinking some beers around a camp fire? Technically it
    sounds like they can be charged with a DUI since the keys and vehicle
    are there and they may even be in the vehicle, but it's hard to that
    sticking if they fought the charge.

    It's all selective enforcement. Yes, the law would make the campers criminals,
    too, but the cops never charge people in situations like that, so the question
    has never come before a court.

    Among other drunk-driving laws that seem to have unintended consequences is >>> the law that basically says, "If it has wheels, it's illegal to be drunk >>> while
    operating it". This is how people riding bicycles, riding lawnmowers, even >>> children's toys, like Big Wheels, have been charged with DUI. However, it >>> would also seem to make it illegal for people in wheelchairs to ever be
    intoxicated.

    Sometimes it doesn't even have to be wheels. I heard of one case of a guy >>> being charged with DUI for riding a horse while drunk. I seem to remember him
    beating the charge because the horse has a mind of its own and will avoid >>> collisions on its own regardless of the idiotic naked ape on its back.

    Then again, maybe they reasoned that
    if he was sleeping drunk at the side of the road, he must have driven >>>> drunk to get to the spot where he was sleeping.

    They could reason that but they couldn't prove that.

    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started >>> drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew
    over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was >>> before she crashed or after she crashed.

    Supposedly, she’s pulled that like half a dozen times. The most famous case it came out she done it four times in a different state before that one.



    --
    The last thing I want to do is hurt you, but it is still on my list.

    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: Easynews - www.easynews.com (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From shawn@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 07:11:57 2025
    On Sun, 17 Aug 2025 14:06:11 -0700, anim8rfsk <anim8rfsk@cox.net>
    wrote:

    BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 1:30:37 PM PDT, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> >> wrote:


    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started
    drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew
    over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was >>>> before she crashed or after she crashed.

    Supposedly, she’s pulled that like half a dozen times. The most famous case >it came out she done it four times in a different state before that one.

    At some point you think they would be able to call her on it. After
    you have pulled the same trick multiple times it shouldn't be a
    defense.

    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From danny burstein@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 07:13:14 2025
    In <mah4akh8590kogq4j89jtc4mcn64fpecjl@4ax.com> shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> writes:

    [snip]

    At some point you think they would be able to call her on it. After
    you have pulled the same trick multiple times it shouldn't be a
    defense.

    obrat: How many times did Bullwinkle try pulling that
    rabbit out of his hat?


    --
    _____________________________________________________
    Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
    dannyb@panix.com
    [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]

    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: PANIX Public Access Internet and UNIX, NYC (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From Rhino@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 07:15:59 2025
    On 2025-08-17 4:23 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 12:53:29 PM PDT, "Rhino" <no_offline_contact@example.com> wrote:

    On 2025-08-17 3:00 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
    Real life prosecutor goes to court with less evidence than Price
    typically presents on an episode of Law & Order

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQINClZopt0

    Truly shitty arrest. Noncom officer from Ft. Knox is driving a vehicle >>> that completely breaks down. He's on the side of the road for a very
    long time. Hours after a celebration of his promotion, cop arrests him >>> for drunk driving because he was given a gift of a bottle of alchohol, >>> and drank some after the break down, then fell asleep.

    Why did the prosecution prefer charges? In her opening remarks, she
    emphasizes that none of her witnesses are witnesses to drunken behavior >>> but the jury is free to infer from the absense of evidence that he must >>> have been driving drunk before his vehicle broke down.

    How did this survive the probable cause hearing?

    I heard about a similar case here in Ontario some years ago. A guy who
    realized he was probably borderline impaired pulled over to the side of
    the road and decided to sleep for a while. The police came along after
    he'd been sleeping awhile and charged him with drunk driving. He pointed
    out that the car was parked, the engine was off and the keys were in his
    pocket but the police said he could have started the car and driven off
    at any time.

    I've never understood this line of logic. If merely having access to car keys is enough to charge someone with drunk driving, then they could theoretically charge you with drunk driving if you're in your home sitting on the sofa watching the ballgame and drinking beers. After all, the car keys are right there on the kitchen counter and you could take them to the garage, start the car, and drive drunk if you want to.

    Until then, I always thought you had to have actually been DRIVING drunk
    to catch a drunk driving charge. I never would have imagined that
    sleeping on the side of the road with alcohol in your system was enough
    to sustain a drunk driving charge.

    There have been people in California that have been charged with DUI because they were intoxicated within a certain distance from their car. If you're standing within 50 feet of your vehicle intoxicated and you're in possession of the keys, they presume you to have access to the vehicle in an intoxicated condition. Again, it would seem the cops could just walk into any bar and start giving all the patrons who have keys in their pockets breathalyzers and then charge them with DUI since they all "have access to their vehicle in an intoxicated condition".

    Among other drunk-driving laws that seem to have unintended consequences is the law that basically says, "If it has wheels, it's illegal to be drunk while
    operating it". This is how people riding bicycles, riding lawnmowers, even children's toys, like Big Wheels, have been charged with DUI. However, it would also seem to make it illegal for people in wheelchairs to ever be intoxicated.

    Did any of those charges turn into convictions or did they all get
    thrown out?

    Sometimes it doesn't even have to be wheels. I heard of one case of a guy being charged with DUI for riding a horse while drunk. I seem to remember him beating the charge because the horse has a mind of its own and will avoid collisions on its own regardless of the idiotic naked ape on its back.

    Then again, maybe they reasoned that
    if he was sleeping drunk at the side of the road, he must have driven
    drunk to get to the spot where he was sleeping.

    They could reason that but they couldn't prove that.

    Exactly. He could have been stone cold sober on the drive then tied one
    on while he was stopped at the side of the road. It would seem
    reasonable to me that a judge or jury should give the benefit of the
    doubt to the accused if they couldn't prove he'd been driving impaired.

    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was before she crashed or after she crashed.


    She may be a drunk but she's not stupid!

    --
    Rhino

    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From Rhino@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 07:18:58 2025
    On 2025-08-17 5:06 PM, anim8rfsk wrote:
    BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 1:30:37 PM PDT, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> >> wrote:

    On Sun, 17 Aug 2025 20:23:29 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>
    wrote:

    On Aug 17, 2025 at 12:53:29 PM PDT, "Rhino" <no_offline_contact@example.com>
    wrote:

    On 2025-08-17 3:00 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
    Real life prosecutor goes to court with less evidence than Price
    typically presents on an episode of Law & Order

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQINClZopt0

    Truly shitty arrest. Noncom officer from Ft. Knox is driving a vehicle >>>>>> that completely breaks down. He's on the side of the road for a very >>>>>> long time. Hours after a celebration of his promotion, cop arrests him >>>>>> for drunk driving because he was given a gift of a bottle of alchohol, >>>>>> and drank some after the break down, then fell asleep.

    Why did the prosecution prefer charges? In her opening remarks, she >>>>>> emphasizes that none of her witnesses are witnesses to drunken behavior >>>>>> but the jury is free to infer from the absense of evidence that he must >>>>>> have been driving drunk before his vehicle broke down.

    How did this survive the probable cause hearing?

    I heard about a similar case here in Ontario some years ago. A guy who >>>>> realized he was probably borderline impaired pulled over to the side of >>>>> the road and decided to sleep for a while. The police came along after >>>>> he'd been sleeping awhile and charged him with drunk driving. He pointed >>>>> out that the car was parked, the engine was off and the keys were in his >>>>> pocket but the police said he could have started the car and driven off >>>>> at any time.

    I've never understood this line of logic. If merely having access to car keys
    is enough to charge someone with drunk driving, then they could theoretically
    charge you with drunk driving if you're in your home sitting on the sofa >>>> watching the ballgame and drinking beers. After all, the car keys are right
    there on the kitchen counter and you could take them to the garage, start the
    car, and drive drunk if you want to.

    Until then, I always thought you had to have actually been DRIVING drunk >>>>> to catch a drunk driving charge. I never would have imagined that
    sleeping on the side of the road with alcohol in your system was enough >>>>> to sustain a drunk driving charge.

    There have been people in California that have been charged with DUI because
    they were intoxicated within a certain distance from their car. If you're >>>> standing within 50 feet of your vehicle intoxicated and you're in possession
    of the keys, they presume you to have access to the vehicle in an intoxicated
    condition. Again, it would seem the cops could just walk into any bar and >>>> start giving all the patrons who have keys in their pockets breathalyzers and
    then charge them with DUI since they all "have access to their vehicle in an
    intoxicated condition".

    So how does California handle people who drink but are out 'camping'
    in an RV. If they were driving then I get them being charged with DUI,
    but what about when they are at a camp site. Maybe cooking up some
    food while drinking some beers around a camp fire? Technically it
    sounds like they can be charged with a DUI since the keys and vehicle
    are there and they may even be in the vehicle, but it's hard to that
    sticking if they fought the charge.

    It's all selective enforcement. Yes, the law would make the campers criminals,
    too, but the cops never charge people in situations like that, so the question
    has never come before a court.

    Among other drunk-driving laws that seem to have unintended consequences is
    the law that basically says, "If it has wheels, it's illegal to be drunk >>>> while
    operating it". This is how people riding bicycles, riding lawnmowers, even >>>> children's toys, like Big Wheels, have been charged with DUI. However, it >>>> would also seem to make it illegal for people in wheelchairs to ever be >>>> intoxicated.

    Sometimes it doesn't even have to be wheels. I heard of one case of a guy >>>> being charged with DUI for riding a horse while drunk. I seem to remember him
    beating the charge because the horse has a mind of its own and will avoid >>>> collisions on its own regardless of the idiotic naked ape on its back. >>>>
    Then again, maybe they reasoned that
    if he was sleeping drunk at the side of the road, he must have driven >>>>> drunk to get to the spot where he was sleeping.

    They could reason that but they couldn't prove that.

    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started
    drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew
    over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was >>>> before she crashed or after she crashed.

    Supposedly, she’s pulled that like half a dozen times. The most famous case it came out she done it four times in a different state before that one.


    It stands to reason that one day she'll have a collision that is nowhere
    near a bar. At that point, she's going to have a really big problem.....

    --
    Rhino

    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From BTR1701@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 07:36:36 2025
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 2:11:57 PM PDT, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:

    On Sun, 17 Aug 2025 14:06:11 -0700, anim8rfsk <anim8rfsk@cox.net>
    wrote:

    BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 1:30:37 PM PDT, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com>
    wrote:


    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started
    drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew
    over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was >>>>> before she crashed or after she crashed.

    Supposedly, she’s pulled that like half a dozen times. The most famous case
    it came out she done it four times in a different state before that one.

    At some point you think they would be able to call her on it. After
    you have pulled the same trick multiple times it shouldn't be a
    defense.

    No matter how many times she's done it, the state still has the burden to
    prove her BAC was over the limit while she was driving.



    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From Melissa Hollingsworth@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 08:00:39 2025
    Verily, in article <107tgqf$22qb6$3@dont-email.me>, did no_offline_contact@example.com deliver unto us this message:
    operating it". This is how people riding bicycles, riding lawnmowers, even children's toys, like Big Wheels, have been charged with DUI. However, it would also seem to make it illegal for people in wheelchairs to ever be intoxicated.

    Did any of those charges turn into convictions or did they all get
    thrown out?


    I've heard of a verified DUI conviction of someone on a riding mower.
    However, he was riding the mower to a liquor store, after his license
    had already been suspended, so there were unusual aspects.

    --
    Saturday Doctor Who watch party 1:00 p.m. Pacific time

    This week: "Inferno" [Third Doctor] https://discord.gg/p3ujkCa4?event=1403862135594811423

    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: n/a (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From moviePig@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 08:05:10 2025
    On 8/17/2025 5:11 PM, shawn wrote:
    On Sun, 17 Aug 2025 14:06:11 -0700, anim8rfsk <anim8rfsk@cox.net>
    wrote:

    BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 1:30:37 PM PDT, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> >>> wrote:


    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started
    drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew
    over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was >>>>> before she crashed or after she crashed.

    Supposedly, she’s pulled that like half a dozen times. The most famous case
    it came out she done it four times in a different state before that one.

    At some point you think they would be able to call her on it. After
    you have pulled the same trick multiple times it shouldn't be a
    defense.

    She's a quaff-law...



    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From Melissa Hollingsworth@3:633/280.2 to All on Mon Aug 18 09:11:38 2025
    Verily, in article <107tjmn$2kfbk$1@dont-email.me>, did
    nobody@nowhere.com deliver unto us this message:

    On 8/17/2025 5:11 PM, shawn wrote:

    At some point you think they would be able to call her on it. After
    you have pulled the same trick multiple times it shouldn't be a
    defense.

    She's a quaff-law...

    LOL.

    --
    Saturday Doctor Who watch party 1:00 p.m. Pacific time

    This week: "Inferno" [Third Doctor] https://discord.gg/p3ujkCa4?event=1403862135594811423

    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: n/a (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From moviePig@3:633/280.2 to All on Tue Aug 19 01:55:03 2025
    On 8/17/2025 7:11 PM, Melissa Hollingsworth wrote:
    Verily, in article <107tjmn$2kfbk$1@dont-email.me>, did
    nobody@nowhere.com deliver unto us this message:

    On 8/17/2025 5:11 PM, shawn wrote:

    At some point you think they would be able to call her on it. After
    you have pulled the same trick multiple times it shouldn't be a
    defense.

    She's a quaff-law...

    LOL.

    (I feared it was too obscure for anyone to get...)



    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: A noiseless patient Spider (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From anim8rfsk@3:633/280.2 to All on Tue Aug 19 08:50:37 2025
    shawn <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> wrote:
    On Sun, 17 Aug 2025 14:06:11 -0700, anim8rfsk <anim8rfsk@cox.net>
    wrote:

    BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 1:30:37 PM PDT, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> >>> wrote:


    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started
    drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew
    over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was >>>>> before she crashed or after she crashed.

    Supposedly, she’s pulled that like half a dozen times. The most famous case
    it came out she done it four times in a different state before that one.

    At some point you think they would be able to call her on it. After
    you have pulled the same trick multiple times it shouldn't be a
    defense.

    As I recall, they couldn’t get her on it because the previous times were in
    a different jurisdiction.


    --
    The last thing I want to do is hurt you, but it is still on my list.

    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: Easynews - www.easynews.com (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From Pluted Pup@3:633/280.2 to All on Thu Aug 21 15:09:52 2025
    On 8/17/25 2:11 PM, shawn wrote:
    On Sun, 17 Aug 2025 14:06:11 -0700, anim8rfsk <anim8rfsk@cox.net>
    wrote:

    BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
    On Aug 17, 2025 at 1:30:37 PM PDT, "shawn" <nanoflower@notforg.m.a.i.l.com> >>> wrote:


    It's why Halle Berry famously walked across the street to a bar and started
    drinking when she got into a car wreck. When the cops got there and she blew
    over the legal limit, the state couldn't prove the alcohol she drank was >>>>> before she crashed or after she crashed.

    Supposedly, she’s pulled that like half a dozen times. The most famous case
    it came out she done it four times in a different state before that one.

    At some point you think they would be able to call her on it. After
    you have pulled the same trick multiple times it shouldn't be a
    defense.


    If it's a valid defense it doesn't matter how many times it's used,
    it's still valid.



    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: ---:- FTN<->UseNet Gate -:--- (3:633/280.2@fidonet)
  • From Pluted Pup@3:633/280.2 to All on Thu Aug 21 15:21:28 2025
    On 8/17/25 12:00 PM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
    Real life prosecutor goes to court with less evidence than Price
    typically presents on an episode of Law & Order

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQINClZopt0

    Truly shitty arrest. Noncom officer from Ft. Knox is driving a vehicle
    that completely breaks down. He's on the side of the road for a very
    long time. Hours after a celebration of his promotion, cop arrests him
    for drunk driving because he was given a gift of a bottle of alchohol,
    and drank some after the break down, then fell asleep.


    I heard from someone who said he was sent home after being
    cited for trespassing during a natural emergency and went home
    and got drunk at home and then the cops came and arrested
    him for drunk driving. But maybe what he said wasn't true.


    Why did the prosecution prefer charges? In her opening remarks, she emphasizes that none of her witnesses are witnesses to drunken behavior
    but the jury is free to infer from the absense of evidence that he must
    have been driving drunk before his vehicle broke down.

    How did this survive the probable cause hearing?


    --- MBSE BBS v1.1.2 (Linux-x86_64)
    * Origin: ---:- FTN<->UseNet Gate -:--- (3:633/280.2@fidonet)