On 2024-11-10, Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> wrote:

On 10/11/24 15:06, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.ÿ And his
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

I am not familiar with the different branches of your military. The
point was that he had a cushy desk job as a spin doctor, was never in
danger and never shook a stick at the enemy.

A Marine does what they're told to do. He enlisted, all gung-ho, while
in high school and not knowing what he wanted to do, a month after the
US declared war on Iraq. Certainly no guarantees of non-combat and zero expectations that he wouldn't be in danger.

Since you're non-US, some background on the Marines. Their slogan, until recently, was "The Few, the Proud". They're the smallest enlistment
branch, and by far have the most intensive, hellish training. *Nobody*
joins the Marines in search of a cushy desk job.

Based on his service and time in Iraq, he probably is the one most
leery of the use of military force among the major party final
candidates for many decades. Certainly much more than the Clintons or
Biden (who knows about Harris). Regarding the Iraq war, he says
American foreign policy establishment has learned zero lessons from what
is perhaps the most unforced and catastrophic error in the history
of this country.
He was against most of the war on terror, and is against the massive
military aid to Ukraine and Israel. He has issues, but worries about
him becoming another Hitler are just ridiculous (even though he was
indeed a corporal as another has argued.)

Chris

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Bobbie Sellers wrote:

Jay E. Morris wrote:

Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.  And his
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

And Vance is the VP Elect.  He will be sworn in on Jan 20, 2025.

Lynn

To slightly correct the correction, he was a non-commissioned office, a
corporal.

Can anyone name a prominent authoritatian leader who was a corporal in WW ? Spinrad I think it was rewrote his life and made
him a SF writer.

I will wait for your well informed replies.

The excerpt at the bottom of this followup names the leader.

My Republican Senator's driveway on the slope of a nearby mountain is as
long as a football field and has a thick grove of evergreens on each
side. It offers a secluded pit stop spot for my spins up the mountain on
a bicycle. Occasionally when a vehicle from the house drives by, the
Senator Doctor sees me, smiles, and stops to ask if everything's OK.
He's a nice enough man in person.

My extended family has hundreds of people in it. About half of them are Democrats. There's a lot of Democrats in my Catholic church too. My late
sister was a Democrat. One of her neighbors is what's known as a "shirt
tail" relative to the Cheney's. When Dick came to town as Veep my sister
was invited to a family get-together. Everybody in town remembers Liz
when she was growing up.

Some of my family members say Big Pharma made our Senator Doctor a multi-millionaire.

If you're anything like the Democrats in my family and church, you
probably don't have much use for RFK Jr. The unelected gatekeeper
below shares the sentiment. Is the fix in for Big Pharma and other
Interests?

Howard Lutnick, Trump's transition team co-chair, states that
RFK Jr. is "not getting a job for the Department of Health and
Human Services."

Lutnick also added that Elon Musk would "help" rather than take
a formal role in the Trump White House.

<https://x.com/AFpost/status/1854753320780677404>



World War Time Loop
Escaping the Myth of the Eternal Second World War

... It would probably not surprise Eliade in the slightest that
the war that broke the world he grew up in became the
foundational myth of the world that grew up in its ruins.
People need myths. They lack the strength to confront the
unfiltered procession of atrocities that Eliade called the
terror of history. In the wake of the unprecedented mass trauma
of global mechanized total warfare, it was inevitable that the
war itself would become mythologized. In the process, World War
Two was stripped of its historicity, emptied of nuance, its
many hues desaturated into shades of grey and then posterized
into stark silhouettes of black and white. It became a comic
book, a horror movie, a video game.

In the popular imagination of the Western normie, World War Two
is an uncomplicated battle between good and evil. Hitler is the
central character of the drama, a dark god of storms, blood, and
iron whose hypnotic presence inspires unthinking devotion and
atavistic werewolf frenzy in all who fall under his spell. ...

<https://barsoom.substack.com/p/world-war-time-loop>

Danke,

--
Don.......My cat's )\._.,--....,'``. https://crcomp.net/reviews.php telltale tall tail /, _.. \ _\ (`._ ,. Walk humbly with thy God.
tells tall tales.. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.' Make 1984 fiction again.


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On Sat, 9 Nov 2024 19:33:14 -0500, Cryptoengineer
<petertrei@gmail.com> wrote:

On 11/9/2024 12:19 PM, Paul S Person wrote:

On Sat, 9 Nov 2024 16:15:37 -0000 (UTC), Don <g@crcomp.net> wrote:

=20
<snippo>

Former Director of the CIA, Catholic Colby made a lot of Deep State
enemies during the Church Committee hearings. There's a Conspiracy =

(eg

Reality) Theory about how Colby was about to expose an Omaha =

pedophilia

ring when he mysteriously met his demise while canoeing back East.

=20
Back in the 80s, one of the "banks" I had money in went belly-up in
Lincoln, NE.
=20
For news, I ended up with a /very/ right-wing newsletter. This did
cover what I was interested in, but it also pursued other theories.
=20
One of which was, indeed, an Omaha pedophile ring (of rich Democrats).
=20
I have often wondered if pursuing this fantasy caused the conspiracy
to be expanded as each level of government looked into it and found
(surprise, surprise) -- nothing. Until we had a guy firing into the
ceiling of a pizza parlor in Florida because he was convinced it was
part of a world-wide pedophile ring (of rich Democrats).
=20
If so, then from a little acorn a mighty oak did grow indeed. "Mighty"
here meaning "very large and elaborate".

You're thinking of the Comet Ping-Pong attack in Washington DC

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizzagate_conspiracy_theory

Thanks for correcting my memory, which was vague.
--=20
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

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On Sat, 9 Nov 2024 20:24:06 +1300, Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> wrote:

On 31/10/24 06:44, William Hyde wrote:
snip

Vance was born to money, but the money vanished due to divorce and
prohibition. So he dropped out of school and took all kinds of tough
jobs from his mid-teens until he began to write.
=20
A common theme in his books is that of a protagonist who starts life
comfortably, experiences disaster, and climbs his way back.=A0 Vance
lived it.

I think that JD, now VP, Vance has written only one book, Hill Billy
Elegy, which tells of his own life before his association with
billionaire Trump supporter Peter Thiel. It is an interesting read and I >recommend it: 3 stars.

I don't actually recommend it (I don't like films about hillbilly drug addicts), but /Hillbilly Elegy/ was made into a movie which might be
shorter to watch than the book would be to read, and should be just as depressing.
--=20
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

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On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 17:21:36 +1300, Titus G <noone@nowhere.com> wrote:

On 10/11/24 15:06, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.=A0 And his
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

I am not familiar with the different branches of your military. The
point was that he had a cushy desk job as a spin doctor, was never in
danger and never shook a stick at the enemy.

This may help explain things a bit: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-commissioned_officer] in general,
and
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-commissioned_officer#United_States]
in particular.

If he was, in fact, a clerk and /claimed/ to be anything else, then
that is a problem. Clerks are important to the overall functioning of
a military unit. Just not as important as the sharp end which is,
after all, the reason the unit exists.

I'm not sure about the Marine Corps, but a 1980s Army Division was at
least 60% /not/ combat troops, perhaps more (details fade). This is
called "tooth to tail": how much of the division is supporting the
combat units.=20

In addition to clerks, there are supply staff, vehicle mechs,
equipment techs, medical personnel, cooks and their assistants ... the
list goes on.

I think Wikipedia is brilliant but quick searches for "extensive",
"contact" and "grandfather" on that page were unsuccessful so in this >instance I shall rely on what Vance himself said in his book; that his >grandfather was a violent pig of an alcoholic and that his major
influence and saviour was his equally violent but sober grandmother.

And Vance is the VP Elect.=A0 He will be sworn in on Jan 20, 2025.

Lynn

=20
To slightly correct the correction, he was a non-commissioned office, =

a

corporal.

--=20
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

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Bobbie Sellers <blissInSanFrancisco@mouse-potato.com> wrote:

Can anyone name a prominent authoritatian leader who was a corporal in
WW ? Spinrad I think it was rewrote his life and made
him a SF writer.

Hitler? Mussolini? Napoleon? All were corporals. Only the first two were
in the world war though.

Idi Amin was a corporal for a while but eventually became a warrant officer. Maybe Habre in Chad too?
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

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Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:

If he was, in fact, a clerk and /claimed/ to be anything else, then
that is a problem. Clerks are important to the overall functioning of
a military unit. Just not as important as the sharp end which is,
after all, the reason the unit exists.

My father was an officer in the Adjudent corps, attached to the 25th
Infantry. I grew up on military bases with other kids who would talk
about how their fathers flew helicopters or drove tanks or shelled
things and I felt kind of left out that my father filled out paperwork.

But, applying for colleges, I realized that my father was absolutely
brilliant at filling out paperwork. "Don't write that," he would say,
"write this other thing that says the same thing but sounds better."
Now that I find myself overwhelmed by bureaucracy and spend more time
filling out computer security paperwork than actually fixing radios in
my job, I realize just how difficult and surprisingly important a thing
it is.

So, while I totally disagree with Vance about just about everything
and I don't have any respect for his fairly recent radical change in the
Trump direction, I have a lot of respect for his service. He volunteered,
he wasn't drafted, and he volunteered into a service that can put one
into the worst possible situations with no notice. He didn't get into
those situations, which seems a good thing to me since the first purpose
of the military is to act as a deterrent.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

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On 11/10/2024 11:03 AM, Paul S Person wrote:

On Sun, 10 Nov 2024 17:21:36 +1300, Titus G<noone@nowhere.com> wrote:

On 10/11/24 15:06, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.ÿ And his
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

I am not familiar with the different branches of your military. The
point was that he had a cushy desk job as a spin doctor, was never in
danger and never shook a stick at the enemy.

This may help explain things a bit: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-commissioned_officer] in general,
and
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-commissioned_officer#United_States]
in particular.

If he was, in fact, a clerk and/claimed/ to be anything else, then
that is a problem. Clerks are important to the overall functioning of
a military unit. Just not as important as the sharp end which is,
after all, the reason the unit exists.

Has never that I've read claimed to be other that a combat journalist.
As far as what the involves and what he did....

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/jd-vance-iraq-military-stolen-valor-b2621540.html


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Cryptoengineer wrote:

Paul S Person wrote:

Don wrote:

<snip>

Former Director of the CIA, Catholic Colby made a lot of Deep State
enemies during the Church Committee hearings. There's a Conspiracy (eg
Reality) Theory about how Colby was about to expose an Omaha pedophilia
ring when he mysteriously met his demise while canoeing back East.

Back in the 80s, one of the "banks" I had money in went belly-up in
Lincoln, NE.

For news, I ended up with a /very/ right-wing newsletter. This did
cover what I was interested in, but it also pursued other theories.

One of which was, indeed, an Omaha pedophile ring (of rich Democrats).

I have often wondered if pursuing this fantasy caused the conspiracy
to be expanded as each level of government looked into it and found
(surprise, surprise) -- nothing. Until we had a guy firing into the
ceiling of a pizza parlor in Florida because he was convinced it was
part of a world-wide pedophile ring (of rich Democrats).

If so, then from a little acorn a mighty oak did grow indeed. "Mighty"
here meaning "very large and elaborate".

You're thinking of the Comet Ping-Pong attack in Washington DC

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pizzagate_conspiracy_theory

The Pulse Nightclub shooting occured in Florida:

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse_nightclub_shooting>

Louis La Roche tells people to "die for the [one big] gay disco:"

<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rL-nKRI74Qk>

Danke,

--
Don.......My cat's )\._.,--....,'``. https://crcomp.net/reviews.php telltale tall tail /, _.. \ _\ (`._ ,. Walk humbly with thy God.
tells tall tales.. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.' Make 1984 fiction again.


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On 11/9/2024 8:06 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.ÿ And his
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

And Vance is the VP Elect.ÿ He will be sworn in on Jan 20, 2025.

Lynn

To slightly correct the correction, he was a non-commissioned office, a corporal.

BTW, a corporal in the US Marine Corps is equivalent to a sergeant in
the US Army.

Lynn


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On 11/11/2024 5:20 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

On 11/9/2024 8:06 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.ÿ And his
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

And Vance is the VP Elect.ÿ He will be sworn in on Jan 20, 2025.

Lynn

To slightly correct the correction, he was a non-commissioned office,
a corporal.

BTW, a corporal in the US Marine Corps is equivalent to a sergeant in
the US Army.

Lynn

Sorry, not.

Marines Army
E-1 Private Private
E-2 Private First Class Private
E-3 Lance Corporal Private First Class
E-4 Corporal Corporal (or Specialist 4, Non-NCO)
E-5 Sergeant Sergeant
E-6 Staff Sergeant Staff Sergeant
E-7 Gunnery Sergeant Sergeant First Class
E-8 Master Sergeant Master Sergeant
E-9 Master Gunnery Sergeant Sergeant Major

Note, E-8 in both when the senior NCO in a company are First Sergeant,
E-9 when senior NCO in a battalion are Sergeant Major in Marines and
Command Sergeant Major in the Army.

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On 11/11/2024 6:36 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/11/2024 5:20 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

On 11/9/2024 8:06 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.ÿ And his
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

And Vance is the VP Elect.ÿ He will be sworn in on Jan 20, 2025.

Lynn

To slightly correct the correction, he was a non-commissioned office,
a corporal.

BTW, a corporal in the US Marine Corps is equivalent to a sergeant in
the US Army.

Lynn

Sorry, not.

ÿÿÿÿ Marinesÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Army
E-1ÿ Privateÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Private
E-2ÿ Private First Classÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Private
E-3ÿ Lance Corporalÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Private First Class
E-4ÿ Corporalÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Corporal (or Specialist 4, Non-NCO)
E-5ÿ Sergeantÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Sergeant
E-6ÿ Staff Sergeantÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Staff Sergeant
E-7ÿ Gunnery Sergeantÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Sergeant First Class
E-8ÿ Master Sergeantÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Master Sergeant
E-9ÿ Master Gunnery Sergeantÿÿÿÿ Sergeant Major

Note, E-8 in both when the senior NCO in a company are First Sergeant,
E-9 when senior NCO in a battalion are Sergeant Major in Marines and
Command Sergeant Major in the Army.

Sorry, going with my son who spent 8 years in the USMC and got out as a Corporal.

Lynn


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On 11/11/2024 6:42 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

On 11/11/2024 6:36 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/11/2024 5:20 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

On 11/9/2024 8:06 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.ÿ And his
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

And Vance is the VP Elect.ÿ He will be sworn in on Jan 20, 2025.

Lynn

To slightly correct the correction, he was a non-commissioned
office, a corporal.

BTW, a corporal in the US Marine Corps is equivalent to a sergeant in
the US Army.

Lynn

Sorry, not.

ÿÿÿÿÿ Marinesÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Army
E-1ÿ Privateÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Private
E-2ÿ Private First Classÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Private
E-3ÿ Lance Corporalÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Private First Class
E-4ÿ Corporalÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Corporal (or Specialist 4, Non-NCO)
E-5ÿ Sergeantÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Sergeant
E-6ÿ Staff Sergeantÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Staff Sergeant
E-7ÿ Gunnery Sergeantÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Sergeant First Class
E-8ÿ Master Sergeantÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ Master Sergeant
E-9ÿ Master Gunnery Sergeantÿÿÿÿ Sergeant Major

Note, E-8 in both when the senior NCO in a company are First Sergeant,
E-9 when senior NCO in a battalion are Sergeant Major in Marines and
Command Sergeant Major in the Army.

Sorry, going with my son who spent 8 years in the USMC and got out as a Corporal.

Lynn

Not unusual for troops not to know unless a person has interaction with
other services. While in did a little training with Marines and their
ranks are close enough to Army that it was easy to learn. 20 years as contractor with the Air Force and I still occasionally screwed up the
senior ranks. Navy? Forget it.

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On 2024-11-12, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:

Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> writes:

On 11/9/2024 8:06 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.ÿ And his
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

And Vance is the VP Elect.ÿ He will be sworn in on Jan 20, 2025.

Lynn

To slightly correct the correction, he was a non-commissioned office, a >>> corporal.

BTW, a corporal in the US Marine Corps is equivalent to a sergeant in
the US Army.

That is not my understanding.

An army Private First class (E-3) is a Lance Corporal in the Corp.
An Army Corporal (E-4) is a Corporal in the Corp.
An Army Sergeant (E-5) is a Sergeant in the Corp.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:United_States_uniformed_services_comparative_ranks

It's primarily a difference in the goals and philosophies of the two
branches (that's why they're different after all!).

The operations and training of Marines is geared at smaller tactical
operations while the Army is concerned with large numbers of troops.
The Marines want experienced troops in their small groups; promotions
in the Marines are much slower than in the Army.

A long-term Corporal in the Marines typically has as much training as
an Army Sergeant of the same vintage. It just will be more tactical
training rather than training on commanding and working with other
troops like the Army Sergeant. The Army needs to have large numbers
of troops work together so it emphasizes development of the officer
hierarchy. The Marines don't.

Chris

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Reply-To: slp53@pacbell.net

Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> writes:

On 11/11/2024 6:36 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/11/2024 5:20 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

On 11/9/2024 8:06 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.  And his
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

And Vance is the VP Elect.  He will be sworn in on Jan 20, 2025.

Lynn

To slightly correct the correction, he was a non-commissioned office, >>>> a corporal.

BTW, a corporal in the US Marine Corps is equivalent to a sergeant in
the US Army.

Lynn

Sorry, not.

     Marines                     Army
E-1  Private                     Private
E-2  Private First Class         Private
E-3  Lance Corporal              Private First Class
E-4  Corporal                    Corporal (or Specialist 4, Non-NCO)
E-5  Sergeant                    Sergeant
E-6  Staff Sergeant              Staff Sergeant
E-7  Gunnery Sergeant            Sergeant First Class
E-8  Master Sergeant             Master Sergeant
E-9  Master Gunnery Sergeant     Sergeant Major

Note, E-8 in both when the senior NCO in a company are First Sergeant,
E-9 when senior NCO in a battalion are Sergeant Major in Marines and
Command Sergeant Major in the Army.

Sorry, going with my son who spent 8 years in the USMC and got out as a >Corporal.

I'll go with my nephew who is currently a Lance Corporal (E-3), soon
to make Corporal(E-4) in the Corp. He's also a certified rifle expert
marksman with 2nd and 3rd requals. Another cousin retired as a
Master Sergeant in the Corp after a 20 year career.

I'll also go with Wikipedia, which also disagrees with you.


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On Mon, 11 Nov 2024 19:51:52 -0600, "Jay E. Morris"
<morrisj@epsilon3.comcon> wrote:

On 11/11/2024 6:42 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

On 11/11/2024 6:36 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/11/2024 5:20 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

On 11/9/2024 8:06 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.=A0 And his=20 >>>>>> grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with=20 >>>>>> extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

And Vance is the VP Elect.=A0 He will be sworn in on Jan 20, 2025. >>>>>>
Lynn

To slightly correct the correction, he was a non-commissioned=20
office, a corporal.

BTW, a corporal in the US Marine Corps is equivalent to a sergeant =

in=20

the US Army.

Lynn

Sorry, not.

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 = Marines=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 Army
E-1=A0 = Private=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 =

Private

E-2=A0 Private First Class=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 Private
E-3=A0 Lance Corporal=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 Private = =46irst Class
E-4=A0 =

Corporal=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 =
Corporal (or Specialist 4, Non-NCO)

E-5=A0 =

Sergeant=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 =
Sergeant

E-6=A0 Staff Sergeant=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 Staff = Sergeant
E-7=A0 Gunnery Sergeant=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 Sergeant =

First Class

E-8=A0 Master Sergeant=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 Master = Sergeant
E-9=A0 Master Gunnery Sergeant=A0=A0=A0=A0 Sergeant Major

Note, E-8 in both when the senior NCO in a company are First =

Sergeant,=20

E-9 when senior NCO in a battalion are Sergeant Major in Marines and=20
Command Sergeant Major in the Army.

=20
Sorry, going with my son who spent 8 years in the USMC and got out as =

a=20

Corporal.
=20
Lynn
=20

Not unusual for troops not to know unless a person has interaction with=20 >other services. While in did a little training with Marines and their=20 >ranks are close enough to Army that it was easy to learn. 20 years as=20 >contractor with the Air Force and I still occasionally screwed up the=20 >senior ranks. Navy? Forget it.

Or they fell asleep during that class in Basic.

Which included Naval ranks, BTW.

Of course, when I say "Basic" I am talking about Army BCT in 1969. Who
can say what they teach 'em now?
--=20
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

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On 12 Nov 2024 02:54:14 GMT, Chris Buckley <alan@sabir.com> wrote:

On 2024-11-12, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:

Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> writes:

On 11/9/2024 8:06 PM, Jay E. Morris wrote:

On 11/9/2024 3:11 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:

Dude, JD Vance was a Marine Corps officer, not Army.=A0 And his=20
grandfather just lived down the street during his childhood with=20
extensive contact.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JD_Vance

And Vance is the VP Elect.=A0 He will be sworn in on Jan 20, 2025.

Lynn

=20
To slightly correct the correction, he was a non-commissioned =

office, a=20

corporal.

BTW, a corporal in the US Marine Corps is equivalent to a sergeant in=20 >>>the US Army.

That is not my understanding.=20

An army Private First class (E-3) is a Lance Corporal in the Corp.
An Army Corporal (E-4) is a Corporal in the Corp.
An Army Sergeant (E-5) is a Sergeant in the Corp.

=

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:United_States_uniformed_services_c= omparative_ranks

It's primarily a difference in the goals and philosophies of the two
branches (that's why they're different after all!).

They are different because the Marines are part of the Navy, and the
Army is not.

Even the Romans had specialized "Naval Infantry" at one point.

The operations and training of Marines is geared at smaller tactical >operations while the Army is concerned with large numbers of troops.
The Marines want experienced troops in their small groups; promotions
in the Marines are much slower than in the Army.

A long-term Corporal in the Marines typically has as much training as
an Army Sergeant of the same vintage. It just will be more tactical
training rather than training on commanding and working with other
troops like the Army Sergeant. The Army needs to have large numbers
of troops work together so it emphasizes development of the officer >hierarchy. The Marines don't.

--=20
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

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On 11/11/24 08:57, Scott Dorsey wrote:
snip

So, while I totally disagree with Vance about just about everything
and I don't have any respect for his fairly recent radical change in the Trump direction, I have a lot of respect for his service. He volunteered,
he wasn't drafted, and he volunteered into a service that can put one
into the worst possible situations with no notice.

This is where we disagree.
Who was he providing a service for by volunteering to participate in the slaughter of more than a million Iraqis and the displacement of a
further four million from a country of twenty million?
The US oil industry?
Bush?
Blair who later made millions as a consultant for a South Korean oil corporation?
At the time he had just finished high school so was an ignorant teenager.
Do you have a lot of respect for suicide bombers, members of the SS, the swastika-tattooed white supremacists of the Azov Battalion...?
I may be being too idealistic but I have greater respect for those
defending their family and communities.

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On Mon, 11 Nov 2024 17:00:42 -0800, The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca>
wrote:

I have a feeling that when my public library comes through with
Hillbilly Elegy I'll spend less time reading it than I did waiting for
it. Last week they sent me an e-mail saying I was now #2 in queue.

I finally got it and have now finished it and while definitely not SF considered it worth my while and generally well written - which is not unexpected given Vance is a grad from a top law school where being
able to write a good brief is pretty much expected.

I was surprised by the role that Amy Chua (author of the Ride of the
Dragon Mother - and a law school prof at Yale) played in Vance's
courtship of his wife (who one would definitely not expected to have
married a hillbilly!) No doubt we'll all know all about her by this
time next year since she also is a Yale Law graduate.

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On Mon, 11 Nov 2024 19:51:52 -0600, "Jay E. Morris"
<morrisj@epsilon3.comcon> wrote:

Not unusual for troops not to know unless a person has interaction with >other services. While in did a little training with Marines and their
ranks are close enough to Army that it was easy to learn. 20 years as >contractor with the Air Force and I still occasionally screwed up the
senior ranks. Navy? Forget it.

Could be worse - my daughter's soon to be father-in-law is a retired
British Army career NCO who won't talk about his career beyond "you
know all those terrible places the British Army has been these last 30
years? Belfast, Afghanistan, Cyprus and all over the Middle East? Well
been there done that to all of them..." (He didn't think anyone in my
family would understand as all of them were either USAF or Royal Navy)

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On Thu, 21 Nov 2024 15:26:01 -0800, The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca>
wrote:

On Mon, 11 Nov 2024 17:00:42 -0800, The Horny Goat <lcraver@home.ca>
wrote:

I have a feeling that when my public library comes through with
Hillbilly Elegy I'll spend less time reading it than I did waiting for
it. Last week they sent me an e-mail saying I was now #2 in queue.

I finally got it and have now finished it and while definitely not SF >considered it worth my while and generally well written - which is not >unexpected given Vance is a grad from a top law school where being
able to write a good brief is pretty much expected.

I was surprised by the role that Amy Chua (author of the Ride of the
Dragon Mother - and a law school prof at Yale) played in Vance's
courtship of his wife (who one would definitely not expected to have
married a hillbilly!) No doubt we'll all know all about her by this
time next year since she also is a Yale Law graduate.

Vance was never near being a hillbilly, he was raised in Middleton
Ohio which is a city 29 miles from Cincinatti
That's not Hillbilly country - and not many hillbillies get private
golf lessons...

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