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  • Re: Self-hosting and the 6502

    From Peter Flass@3:633/10 to All on Sat Apr 4 15:48:29 2026
    On 4/4/26 14:55, John Levine wrote:
    According to Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com>:
    On 4/3/26 20:57, Lawrence D?Oliveiro wrote:
    On Fri, 03 Apr 2026 16:53:28 -1000, Lynn Wheeler wrote:

    Largest 360/67 1-CPU had one mbyte memory ... mostly taken up by
    TSS/360 kernel ...

    Wikipedia says TSS was not a great success.

    Did any timesharing OSes from IBM enjoy much success? Maybe TSO? Did
    that do multiuser, without the need for VMs?

    Obviously VM/CMS. Non-IBM MTS was fairly popular in the education community.

    Single language APL\360 was also pretty popular, supporting a lot of interactive
    users on a 360/50.


    IBM also had Conversational Programming System (CPS) that supported
    BASIC and PL/I. Don't know about FORTRAN.

    --- PyGate Linux v1.5.13
    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From Lynn Wheeler@3:633/10 to All on Sat Apr 4 12:53:28 2026
    antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) writes:
    AFAICS main factor was that TSS/360 was too big, which left too
    little core for users which lead to intensive paging when one
    tried to increase number of users. Also, VM quite early got
    good paging algorithm, other IBM systems used worse algorithms
    and improved them only later.

    trivia: at the time TSS/360 was "decomitted", there were 1200 people in
    the TSS/360 organization and 12 people in the CP67/CMS group.

    the CP67/CMS organization got even smaller by the time I graduated and
    joined CSC with the commercial CP67/CMS online 60s' spin-offs of CSC
    (along with some from MIT Lincoln Labs).

    --
    virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970

    --- PyGate Linux v1.5.13
    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From Lawrence D?Oliveiro@3:633/10 to All on Sat Apr 4 23:44:16 2026
    On Sat, 04 Apr 2026 12:53:28 -1000, Lynn Wheeler wrote:

    trivia: at the time TSS/360 was "decomitted", there were 1200 people
    in the TSS/360 organization and 12 people in the CP67/CMS group.

    I wonder how many people at DEC worked on TOPS-10 ... remember, they
    were able to provide true multiuser support from the get-go, which CMS
    could not.

    --- PyGate Linux v1.5.13
    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From John Levine@3:633/10 to All on Sun Apr 5 02:27:21 2026
    According to Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com>:
    On 4/4/26 14:55, John Levine wrote:
    Did any timesharing OSes from IBM enjoy much success? Maybe TSO? Did
    that do multiuser, without the need for VMs?

    Obviously VM/CMS. Non-IBM MTS was fairly popular in the education community.

    Single language APL\360 was also pretty popular, supporting a lot of interactive
    users on a 360/50.

    IBM also had Conversational Programming System (CPS) that supported
    BASIC and PL/I. Don't know about FORTRAN.

    That was QUIKTRAN.


    --
    Regards,
    John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
    Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

    --- PyGate Linux v1.5.13
    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)
  • From David Wade@3:633/10 to All on Sun Apr 5 09:29:26 2026
    On 05/04/2026 00:44, Lawrence D?Oliveiro wrote:
    On Sat, 04 Apr 2026 12:53:28 -1000, Lynn Wheeler wrote:

    trivia: at the time TSS/360 was "decomitted", there were 1200 people
    in the TSS/360 organization and 12 people in the CP67/CMS group.

    I wonder how many people at DEC worked on TOPS-10 ... remember, they
    were able to provide true multiuser support from the get-go, which CMS
    could not.

    No but CMS is still in use today, and it still doesn't provide true
    multi user support whatever that is


    --- PyGate Linux v1.5.13
    * Origin: Dragon's Lair, PyGate NNTP<>Fido Gate (3:633/10)